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14th January 2019 19:49:24 GM Quillon View post »
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Sonnema
Player

Pharos
Level 292
Mage
16th January 2019 11:15:08

Quoting Huligan:
Also rangers hit rangers too hard and rangers hit warriors to low.

Give rangers 10-20% arrow resist.
Give rangers higher armor penetration towards warriors 5-10%.

Rangers are fine dmg wise. Rangers are not meant to kill warriors. Warriors are supposed to be "tank".
Mages will do the burst dmg to kill a tank, rangers will be there to dps them as much as they can.
Baltas
Player

Pharos
Level 323
Mage
16th January 2019 11:36:07 (Last edited 16th January 2019 19:12:59)

Quoting Huligan:
Also rangers hit rangers too hard and rangers hit warriors to low.

Give rangers 10-20% arrow resist.
Give rangers higher armor penetration towards warriors 5-10%.


Ofc I agree, it's my idea after all haha.

Rangers could absorb around 10-20% of arrow dmg
And both rangers and warrior could Ignore warriors defence by 5-10%. Let's say warrior have 50armor eq and 50 defending skill. After the change warriors and rangers gonna hit him as he had 45-48 armor eq and 45-48 defending skill.

If this small change would appear then I would agree that magic resistance talent would work like 0.04% pvm magic resistance per point and 0.02% pvp magic resistance per point. So maxed out talents would give 10% pvp magic resistance.

Results if all changed appeared:
Rangers would be a little more tanky vs rangers/mages (as fragile to warriors as now) dont forget Mage>warrior>ranger>mage
Ranger would be a little bit stronger vs warrior and weaker against other rangers damage wise

warriors would be a little bit more fragile to warriors/rangers and a little more tanky vs mages (I know warrior gotta be physical blocker, but it's too extreme situation in zezenia when warrior doesn't give a f*** when he gets atacked by rangers/warriors and they are super afraid of mages)
warrior would hit as strong to rangers/mages as before and they would hit a little harder on other warriors

Mage would hit a little lower to everyone
Mage would receive as much damage from warriors/rangers as before. Mages would receive a little less dmg from magic (if staff reduce NMR and fix stacking buffs there will surely be space for magic reduction). Cuz mages were tanky vs pvp magic dmg only because buff stacked with eq + NMR depending on lvl too much and there was no cap.
If I was in staff I would leave NMR as it was but when lvl+mlvl reaches 100 NMR would start to scale.
Once lvl+mlvl reaches 100 NMR gain would slower 1.1x, at 400 would slower 1.1x again, at 500 would slower 1.1x again etc.


lvl+mlvl/ NMR / How many levels gained in that range/ ^
100 0.105263158
200 0.200956938 100
300 0.287951283 100 2
400 0.367037052 100 3
500 0.438933205 100 4
600 0.504293344 100 5
700 0.563711653 100 6
800 0.617728297 100 7
900 0.666834337 100 8
1000 0.711476191 100 9
1100 0.752059695 100 10
1200 0.78895379 100 11
1300 0.822493876 100 12
1400 0.852984863 100 13
1500 0.880703943 100 14
1600 0.905903106 100 15
1700 0.928811436 100 16
1800 0.949637191 100 17
1900 0.968569695 100 18
2000 0.985781062 100 19

It shows at what level what NMR people will have. (column with 100's shows how many levels you gained in each bracket. so if you are level 55m lvl 40 u will have to rewrite the first 100 into 95 NMR will change automatically). Numbers 2>19 shows many many times NMR levels scaled. If staff is interested Excel file is Here

For a long time you need mlvl + lvl to be 950 to reach 100% magic resistance. In my formula at 950lvl you will have 69% magic resistance.
to reach 100% your lvl + m lvl will have to be 2091. With current system it will never happen and we won't even get close to that. so top mages will be under 50% NMR for a long (lvl + m lvl = 594)
Ht Savage
Player

Pharos
Level 401
Mage
17th January 2019 15:48:27 (Last edited 17th January 2019 22:22:42)

GM Shadow
Game Master

17th January 2019 16:16:55

The calculation is meant to flatten quickly after level 200 as written.

You must consider that a level 400 will likely have significant boost from better magic resist gear, more HP, and more healing power etc.

Example with same MR gear taking 500 magic spell damage:

A level 200 Warlock has about 1400HP. 500/1400 = 36% of HP lost
A level 400 Warlock has about 2400 HP 500/2400 = 21% of HP lost

And then a level 400 has a much stronger heal, so they can recover heavy damage much easier.
They will also have numerous talent points in legerity, healing boost, fortification etc.

There are many aspects to the formula we must consider rather than just the damage number only.
Dancore
Premium

Pharos
Level 473
Mage
17th January 2019 17:19:50

Quoting GM Shadow:
The calculation is meant to flatten quickly after level 200 as written.

You must consider that a level 400 will likely have significant boost from better magic resist gear, more HP, and more healing power etc.

Example with same MR gear taking 500 magic spell damage:

A level 200 Warlock has about 1400HP. 500/1400 = 36% of HP lost
A level 400 Warlock has about 2400 HP 500/2400 = 21% of HP lost

And then a level 400 has a much stronger heal, so they can recover heavy damage much easier.
They will also have numerous talent points in legerity, healing boost, fortification etc.

There are many aspects to the formula we must consider rather than just the damage number only.


Significant boost from magic gear, like 5% i wouldn't consider it being that significant.

More hp, sure yes that's obvious.

Fort talent? That's a joke, it barely even felt on a mage before update and now when defense lowered that talent is useless.

Healing power? Ofc higher lvls heal more when you consider that Ht Savage heals around 60%~ ish of his hp with 1 heal and 200 wl like +65% ish~ Also a 200 mage should have healing boost talent at that point already.

We heal kinda the same amount percentage wise, the higher lvl you get the less of your hp in percentage you can recover with a single heal.


You take all those in consideration alright then start taking other things as well, how about closer tight pvp fights or trap fights where legerity means nothing.

After all it's mages vs mages NMR and damage update and test server, why even talk about speed or physical defense.

What i don't agree with that 2x 200 mages can almost headshot a 200 mage, and 3x 200 mages can almost headshot 400 mage, that is not how it should be at all. There would be no attraction to lvl a high lvl if you are so insanely squishy in pvp and are weak to all classes.

Also that 400 cannot kil a lvl 200 so it just blows my mind that a 400 needs a friend to kill a 200 but you only need 3x 200's to kill a 400.
Baltas
Player

Pharos
Level 323
Mage
17th January 2019 17:22:48

Quoting GM Shadow:
The calculation is meant to flatten quickly after level 200 as written.

You must consider that a level 400 will likely have significant boost from better magic resist gear, more HP, and more healing power etc.

Example with same MR gear taking 500 magic spell damage:

A level 200 Warlock has about 1400HP. 500/1400 = 36% of HP lost
A level 400 Warlock has about 2400 HP 500/2400 = 21% of HP lost

And then a level 400 has a much stronger heal, so they can recover heavy damage much easier.
They will also have numerous talent points in legerity, healing boost, fortification etc.

There are many aspects to the formula we must consider rather than just the damage number only.


Why don't you flatten in few times (as in my previous example) not too quickly. Because right now h lvl mages gonna be very fragile. I totaly agree that h lvl mages were too tanky vs mages. But now 400 warlock will die instantly in war. Like 2x200 rangers hit him constantly and 2x 200 mages make 1 clear combo. Thats it. That's not considering that a guy can get dispelled etc.
Insane Magickz
Player

Platon
Level 30
Mage
17th January 2019 17:34:38

Quoting Dancore:
Quoting GM Shadow:
The calculation is meant to flatten quickly after level 200 as written.

You must consider that a level 400 will likely have significant boost from better magic resist gear, more HP, and more healing power etc.

Example with same MR gear taking 500 magic spell damage:

A level 200 Warlock has about 1400HP. 500/1400 = 36% of HP lost
A level 400 Warlock has about 2400 HP 500/2400 = 21% of HP lost

And then a level 400 has a much stronger heal, so they can recover heavy damage much easier.
They will also have numerous talent points in legerity, healing boost, fortification etc.

There are many aspects to the formula we must consider rather than just the damage number only.


Significant boost from magic gear, like 5% i wouldn't consider it being that significant.

More hp, sure yes that's obvious.

Fort talent? That's a joke, it barely even felt on a mage before update and now when defense lowered that talent is useless.

Healing power? Ofc higher lvls heal more when you consider that Ht Savage heals around 60%~ ish of his hp with 1 heal and 200 wl like +65% ish~ Also a 200 mage should have healing boost talent at that point already.

We heal kinda the same amount percentage wise, the higher lvl you get the less of your hp in percentage you can recover with a single heal.


You take all those in consideration alright then start taking other things as well, how about closer tight pvp fights or trap fights where legerity means nothing.

After all it's mages vs mages NMR and damage update and test server, why even talk about speed or physical defense.

What i don't agree with that 2x 200 mages can almost headshot a 200 mage, and 3x 200 mages can almost headshot 400 mage, that is not how it should be at all. There would be no attraction to lvl a high lvl if you are so insanely squishy in pvp and are weak to all classes.

Also that 400 cannot kil a lvl 200 so it just blows my mind that a 400 needs a friend to kill a 200 but you only need 3x 200's to kill a 400.

I blame it on the 25% pvp damage reduction AND the creation of high exp rate servers. To me, it killed Zezenia.

Damage was ok, maybe 5-10% pvp damage reduction would make sense, but making high exp rate servers was a dead end road.
Baltas
Player

Pharos
Level 323
Mage
17th January 2019 17:41:32 (Last edited 17th January 2019 17:52:12)

The thing is that mages damage raises faster than durability.

so in test server.
2x200 mages cant kill 200mage in a combo
2x500 mages can easily kill 500lvl mage

This shows that new formula scales too fast or too early flattens

Edit:
500vs500 warlock i meant. Maybe 500 pyro can survive 2x 500 mages
Dancore
Premium

Pharos
Level 473
Mage
17th January 2019 17:58:31

Quoting Baltas:
The thing is that mages damage raises faster than durability.

so in test server.
2x200 mages cant kill 200mage in a combo
2x500 mages can easily kill 500lvl mage

This shows that new formula scales too fast or too early flattens


This.

Basically as Baltas said to me very high lvl mages got too weak and 200 mages insanely strong.

Owning a 400 mage is hard life in pvp worlds compared that you can just have 200 mage with couple of friends and you can kill anybody of any lvl with those changes.

As Baltas said as well that the way you do this is bad. You change the formula without checking numbers at all and tell us to test on test server, without being there yourself active to take notes and feedback... Then making us to post here and wait for a response.

Why not changing little by little and see the numbers yourself if it makes sense instead of telling us to go and test. When it makes sense tell us to go test. Right now it does not feel like you check anything, you just change and that's it.

Very bad way or it simply means as a fully non-pvp staff you don't even understand what you're changing. (Not to make fun or insult, just saying how we pvpers feel like it's happening)
Casted
Player

Pharos
Level 318
Mage
17th January 2019 18:18:24 (Last edited 17th January 2019 18:23:21)

What would be the point of levelling a mage after 200 on a PVP server?
Death blow is only reduced by 30 going from level 200 to 400 hahaha, good job :D

A level 200 has:- 317 587 698 EXP
A level 400 has:- 2 710 601 389 EXP (Estimated)

If you make 5kk/h EXP it would take 480 hours to get from 200 to 400, why would anyone spend that amount of time for no gain on a PVP server?

EDIT: It's like the staff are trying their hardest to kill the PVP servers of this game and I don't know why.
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